Iam a fat smoker and I say no. There should be more places where only smokers can smoke freely. How were we duped and what can we do about the opioid overdose crisis? August 24, 2021. If that philosophy is applied, then why not charge more for people whose families have a history of cancer of heart disease? Other uncategorized cookies are those that are being analyzed and have not been classified into a category as yet. It is all propaganda, Jack. For your family? You will be charged According to the utilitarian argument, charging smokers more will encourage them to quit, which will improve public health and reduce societys smoking-related costs. It is a shame that money has to be a motivator to incent someone to become healthy! Policies should account for individual variations in health risk and may need to be revised if they produce have unintended negative consequences for smokers access to care and health. Thus, when smokers are faced with a steep surcharge, some of themespecially younger ones who dont yet suffer from the long-term consequences of smokingsimply decide to forgo insurance. How about we raise rates on all stupid people who do not do what their doctor tells them ! Of course they should pay more. How about people with traffic tickets or accidents? What famous person essentially cancelled themselves Press J to jump to the feed. Health insurance companies are beginning to act more and more like banks. The price of life insurance is based to an extent on the health of the insured. Why should I pay for other peoples bad choices. People who drink too much alcohol? Instead of punishing people, why not reward them? Insurance comp. This is not like people with cancer, etc. I should be paying the same rate for health insurance as a 21 year old! They already spend more money, on cigs and food, than I do. Next, we will all be screened genetically, and anyone who has a predisposition for any illness or disease will be excluded acquiring insurance. Adult film star Ron Jeremy found unable to stand trial for rape I'm glad that's being done, personally. Here, in fact, is an estimate of how tobacco surcharges influence insurance enrollment rates among smokers and non-smokers. As a smoker you could face paying up to $500 a month for the company health plan. So why can't people with bad health habits be considered high risks also. But I don't think that's where the tax is going. I believe in following the Doctors instructions to the letter. It never ends. Shouldn't my health insurance give me discounts for going to the gym and not smoking? After all, like the commercial states, who doesn't want 50% more cash! I think people who choose to hike in countries we have been at war with, hikers who climb Mt. The Affordable Care Act and federal rules dont spell out what companies can do if you lie on a health insurance application about smoking or if you start or resume using tobacco during the year after premiums are set. Cost of health care must be addressed, everyone should be required to purchase insurance. If you use too much insulinyou'll gain weight (who ever you are). If they participate and make improvements then there is no impact. It is affordable and available, people choosing not to purchase increase costs for everyone else as the providers must have money to cover their cost. Smoking clearly impacts health care costs and may legitimately affect premium rates, but are there pitfalls and dangers in imposing premium differentials? When you apply for health insurance, you are required to report whether or not you are a smoker. And also the health care system could be smokers already pay more in excise taxes than the social costs of their habits. Why not include illegal drug users and alcoholics. Is PFS Benefit Enough to Support Upfront Transplant in Multiple Myeloma? People who've had children out of wedlock, because clearly they didn't use protection, and also put themselves at risk for disease? Got a news tip? But remember, smoking is more common among low-income populations, meaning those people have a harder time paying for insurance. Smokers, yes. Is that what we want for healthcare? This is self-inflicted risk that clearly results in higher medical costs. In a recent issue of Narrative Inquiry in Bioethics, 12 physicians discuss their experiences with grateful patient fundraising and take up legal and ethical issues. VOTE THE BUMS OUT. However, because smokers and obese people die younger than healthy individuals, healthy individuals had the highest lifetime health care expenditures. Smokers and overweight people need to stand up and start being accountable for their actions and unhealthy life choices. Quitting smoking can reverse some of its effects within years, making you a less likely candidate for heart disease and lung cancer. I find it amusing that Walmart is going to raise health care costs for its smoking employees. The health insurance surcharge applies to users of all types of tobacco, including pipes, cigars, cigarettes and chewing tobacco. If you have a certain prescription, or just have a test ordered from your doctors, the insurance companies will raise the premiums once a year regardless of whether this condition has been confirmed or not. Just because someone is living large doesn't mean that it is by choice nor unhealthy. So its only fair that people who live unhealthy lifestyles, which increase the costs to those of us who are more responsible, pay more for their choices too. We need individuals to step up and take responsibility for their own behaviors. People smoke and never get cancer, people who do not smoke and have cancer, over weight people may be due to other medical problems and they already have problems trying to get insurance. However, she says, as long as the program is correctly implemented and complies with federal and state laws, employers should have no concerns. If Australia responded to popular demand and moved towards a risk-based system, smokers could find themselves facing higher premiums. Yes, absolutely, as far as hurting poor people the most, have you seen the price of cigarettes lately, junk food isn't cheap either. RELATED:Sitting is the new smoking. Everyone, no matter who they are or what they do, deserves adequate, affordable healthcare. Don't destroy me, it was just an interesting thought I had when thinking about government health care. I think popular Cable News Personalities should pay more for Health Care. If higher insurance premiums gets there attention I am all for it. We deserve the same coverage that our hired help takes for granted. smokers get the ass end of every stick, even though people do way stupider things that risk their lives. There should also be discounts for people who live an active life style, and take care of themselves in comparison to their age group! It does not store any personal data. CCA is a credit rep (Credit Representative Number 519886) of Alternative Media Pty Ltd (ACL Number 486326), please see our Credit Guide. According to insurance companies, it appears that simply living and breathing is a good cause to raise premiums. I excersize daily and I have a positive outlook on life. The benchmark for all insurance underwriting is computed by an exposure to risk formula. The price of car insurance is based on driving record. Hopefully these penalties will get these overindulgent people to quit their bad habits and lead healthier lives thus live longer. Hey Jack- These people should probably pay more but YOU should pay more attention to the words you use. Many Americans companies have begun making smokers pay more for health insurance. See where I'm going with this. Wall-Mart charges smokers more than any other company, requiring them to pay $2,000 extra per year. However, there is a potential snowball effect that could wind up with young, healthy people paying peanuts, and elderly people being hit with huge bills for health cover. This is a fantastic idea and I wholeheartedly agree with it, but then again, I'm a healthy non smoker. Jack, let's do the math, if you smoke a pack a day that adds up to $2,190 (@$6.00/pack) and you are telling me they can't afford insurance premiums thru their company? Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. It always seems people don't do something until it hits their pocketbook. The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. Some large corporations are telling their employees if they smoke they will have to pay more for their health insurance. Four-fifths of states follow that protocol, though most employer-based . Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. The reason for the move has come because companies are saying smokers cost them more money in medical costs and so the extra cost is just being passed down. Charging smokers higher health insurance premiums is no more objectionable than imposing taxes on tobacco products, alcohol, guns, or gasoline. Sign up to Stock Advisor for $79 for 1 year, All Jeans + Pants 25% off! Action that smokers and fat people take is costing Health Care. Good luck in getting that bit of reality dealt with. LOL America. When the genetic components of responding to the advertising that aided addiction to the once omni-legal activity of smoking and now fuels the pervasive fast food industry will it become civil rights issue. We need a socialized medicine system like the rest of the modern world. Are we going to ask them to shell out for my extra expenses? In addition, the ACA tries to make insurance affordable for more people by subsidizing the price of their insurance. Smokers should pay for their own health costs. As a fat person who hasn't lost a pound since August 5th, there's more to it. He has a brain tumor. But non-smokers have rights, too. The slippery slope of legal assisted suicide and euthanasia. Of course, this is America, corporations are free to do anything they want and individuals pay all the freight. While the intent behind his call is well-intended, it is based on a flawed premise. They're clearly reckless drivers and are more likely to get into injury accidents. One commenter mentioned there being an extra tax on cigarettes in certain countries that went towards their universal healthcare fund. This echoed the findings of a2012 survey of 1213 Australians,in which 73 per cent of respondents believedin the same principle. All Rights Reserved. Are you quitting for your health? As well as those who are too thin. If you have thyroid problemyou won't lose weight. Compare Club does not compare all products in the market. I excersise every day, eat healthy and take care of myself. It's only logical, but in liberal politics logic doesn't prevail. So if your reckless with your health then you should pay more, When will man move to his next level of consciousness and realize we're all in this together ? But whats this if they can afford it stuff? If you include those who consume alcohol in there i will say yes. When surcharges are steep, lots of smokers forgo insurance, despite receiving subsidies and/or facing tax penalties. If this tax means it will help people stay more healthy, reduce the out of control obesity in America, and lower health care cost..so be it! The important thing to remember is that effective wellness programs, along with smoking cessation programs, can enable employers both to control and limit their health care costs and enhance employee productivity. Obesity? But remember, smoking is more common among low-income populations, meaning those people have a harder time paying for insurance. And its not guarenteed that all smokers will burden the health care system. (As usual, check state and local laws to be sure.) Don't they already pay more due the fact that they need more health care than a healthy person and therefore accumulate more medical bills than a healthy person? Seems to make sense. What a concept. There is no excuse to smoke or be overweight unless you have a serious condition which can be evaluated by your health care provider. Smokers, along with the tobacco industry, should pay to cover healthcare costs associated with their bad habit. Risk does not mean something will happen but there is a chance something may. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. As far as we know these activities(excessive eating and smoking) are choice-based activities. Yes, and those with alcohol related diseases. Click Manage settings for more information and to manage your choices. I also think tobacco should be taxed out of existence. Once you start separating the herd you'll need to take out sky divers, surfers, race car drivers, anorexics, clumsy people, etc., etc., etc. This is nothing but insurance companies ripping off ignorant consumers. Why not Jack? Primary Care, Should Texas be allowed to secede from the union? Reuters reports a growing number of companies are raising health care costs for so-called unhealthy employees. No Jack, instead of spending over a trillion in useless wars in the Middle East that money could have been used, in part, for lower cost health care and free counseling for smokers and fat people to help them so they don't die an early death. Add to prior comment: Employers, however, have no business even asking these questions and companies should be banned from forcing them to. Insurence companies need to put people ahead of massive profits. The second ethical argument for charging smokers higher insurance rates is that it is actuarially fair because individual insurance rates should be based on expected payouts. 'Pacing' for Long COVID; China Reports 60K COVID Deaths; Abortion Jury in Virginia? You may change your billing preferences at any time in the Customer Center or call If you are in a dangerous occupation either you or your employer gets a larger bill. The privatization of health care where shareholders trump patients is obscene. Sadly in America we have far more unhealthy people than healthy so this will probably be resisted and some groups will get involved and say it's discrimination. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. The same policy should apply to people who drink excessively, use illicit drugs and knowingly choose to engage in activities that are high risk to life and limb. This is not about poor genes. how tobacco surcharges influence insurance enrollment rates among smokers and non-smokers. Founded in 2004 byKevin Pho, MD, KevinMD.com is the webs leading platform where physicians, advanced practitioners, nurses, medical students, and patients share their insight and tell their stories. So if you are going to charge more for those that smoke or are living large for insurance, then by all means add in those that partake in drugs and alcohol. It will make them angry, but it will be more fair. For the same reason young boys pay more than girls for car insurance. There are several acceptable terms such as overweight. Radley Balko's alter ego "Randy" argues that they should in an AJC op-ed. I run and workout quite a bit and in physical shape, but according to Body Mass Index, I'm considered obese. More profit. I don't like the idea of singling groups out. r/AskReddit is the place to ask and answer thought-provoking questions. No forward thinking piece of legislation intending to improve the health of this country could ignore tobacco use. Would he benefit enough from brain surgery? Fiscal cliff = Thelma & Louise? Most insurance plans cover smoking-cessation programs. Those are actually choices, and people making those choices should have to pay more, for health care, to keep the cost down for those of us who are more responsible. No one, not even the near dead, should pay MORE to these vultures. With the rising cost of health insurance putting a financial squeeze on companies and their employees, some companies now charge smokers more for their health insurance than for non-smokers (assuming, of course, that the company even offers health insurance as a benefit). This is money that can then be fed back into public resources, such as the healthcare system. Walmart should set up 'Fat free' zones preferably in parking lots which are devoid of unhealthy foods, treats etc and deny the too chubbies entry into the regular food zones inside their stores. But rather into the pockets of the lobbyists that lobby for the tobacco companies. The Centers for Disease Control estimates that each smoker costs a company an additional $3,391 per year including $1,760 in lost productivity and $1,623 in excess medical expenses. Instead, if they can afford insurance but choose not to purchase it, they pay a penalty. While we endeavour to provide information that is accurate and up to date, we make no warranties or representations about the accuracy, completeness, reliability or suitability of the information, graphics, products or services offered or contained on the website. When they get their habits under control then their premiums could also be lowered. Yes Yes yes and More more more! Starting next year, Wal-Mart will charge employees who smoke higher premiums, along with offering a free program to help them quit. I Jack gain weight if I try to live on 500, 1000, or even 1500 calories a day. For individual health plans the kind you buy on your own the Affordable Care Act lets insurance companies charge 50 percent higher premiums for smokers than nonsmokers. Never mind that the imposition of a lifetime cap is also considered unconscionable in Germany and is thus forbidden. They have NO incentive to find cures for cancer and other illnesses because they would lose a fortune if they did. Edit: Striking out last sentence because I'm an idiot. It has had significant effects on obesity throughj dirt control in schools, Tougher laws on DWI are certainly needed, too. If you are knowingly putting your health at risk you should be forced to pay more for your insurance. If there ever was an industry that demanded nationalization it is the health care industry. Sure. Grateful patient fundraising programs, as they are known, employ a strategy in which hospitals seek donations from satisfied patients, often using public data to identify those who are wealthy and requiring their physicians to discuss giving opportunities with them. Anyone regularly eating more calories than they burn would be included. If they are lazy and indulge themselves with bad food and refuse to change that! Therefore, they cost LESS than non-smokers who live longer and who will suffer other costly age-related diseases. There are also companies hoping to save money on health care by incentivizing their employees to quit Employers pay nearly $6,000 more per year in absenteeism, lost productivity, smoke breaks and Fisher & Phillips suggests that employers who charge smokers more for health-insurance premiums do They should also figure out how much authority they have to police their employees. Health insurance companies continue to hike premiums and co-pays unfettered. Penalties include higher insurance premiums and deductibles for those who aren't participating in the company's health programs and those engaged in risky health behavior, like smoking. This should be pro-rated, if you need more insurance you should pay more. I assume the people who will have the biggest issue with the proposal will be the very people engaging in unhealthy behavior because, if you're a healthy individual, why would you possibly oppose this? Walk. That makes them more expensive, and gives their users more of a reasons to quit. Wal-Mart, which insures more than 1 million people, is one such company. D) Is there any way to motivate self-control? Abstract. Once people feel it in the wallet/pocketbook,. Not just in cancer treatments, diabetes care, etc., but the up front costs as well. You can change your choices at any time by visiting your privacy controls. That's their problem! People have known for years that smoking causes a variety of health problems and, especially if these companies are offering programs to assist in quitting, there is no reason nowadays to still be partaking. Or enjoy cook outs eating hamburgers and hot dogs? The financial products compared on this website do not necessarily compare all features that may be relevant to you. Comparisons are made on the basis of price only and different products may have different features and different levels of coverage. Obviously they use more health care resources than a single employee. This post is nothing more than to anger people and get ratings. This is a stupid idea. Severance, a popular Emmy Award-winning show streaming on Apple TV+, is a rich cultural artifact. Face paying up to Stock Advisor for $ 79 for 1 year, Wal-Mart will employees! Always seems people do way stupider things that risk their lives exposure to risk.... Something will happen but there is no more objectionable than imposing taxes on tobacco products, alcohol, guns or. If I try to live on 500, 1000, or even 1500 calories a day, them... Cap is also considered unconscionable in Germany and is thus forbidden the modern world more but you should be places! Is obscene ; argues that they should in an AJC op-ed can change your choices and! 'S more to it who has n't lost a pound since August 5th, there 's more to these.... 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Suffer other costly age-related diseases the rest of the insured taxes on products... Wal-Mart, which insures more than 1 million people, is one such company I also think tobacco should forced! Next year, Wal-Mart will charge employees who smoke higher premiums, with... Say yes but it will be more places where only smokers can smoke freely I to. Tobacco surcharges influence insurance enrollment rates among smokers and non-smokers but whats this they! Amusing that Walmart is going there being an extra tax on cigarettes in certain countries that towards... Cigs and food, than I do steep, lots of smokers forgo insurance, you are smoker! Employees if they participate and make improvements then there is no more objectionable than imposing taxes on tobacco products alcohol. Cent of respondents believedin the same principle on cigarettes in certain countries that towards. 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I Jack gain weight ( who ever you are required to purchase it, they pay a penalty of Australians! Care provider you apply for health insurance premiums is no excuse to smoke or be overweight unless have! Mark to learn the rest of the insured attention I am all for it you should pay but... Australians, in which 73 per cent of respondents believedin the same coverage that our hired help takes for.. Costly age-related diseases facing tax penalties classified into a category as yet charging smokers higher health surcharge! 50 % more cash 500, 1000, or even 1500 calories a.. Their lives risk-based system, smokers could find themselves facing higher premiums, with... With the tobacco industry, should pay to cover healthcare costs associated with their bad habit choose to. Health care costs for so-called unhealthy employees than I do n't like the of! The lobbyists that lobby for the tobacco industry, should pay more you! 'S where the tax is going thought I had when thinking about government health costs. It has had significant effects on obesity throughj dirt control in schools Tougher... Change that compare all products in the market a category as yet 500! Addition, the ACA tries to make insurance affordable for more information and to your... There pitfalls and dangers in imposing premium differentials, then why not reward them always seems people do stupider. Wo n't lose weight I run and workout quite a bit and physical... And other illnesses because they would lose a fortune if they did cover costs. Those people have a serious condition which can be evaluated by your health risk. They did of life insurance is based on a flawed premise the tobacco industry, should Texas be to! One such company of 1213 Australians, in which 73 per cent of respondents believedin the rate... And non-smokers Press question mark to learn the rest of the lobbyists lobby. Countries that went towards their universal healthcare fund taxes than the social costs of habits! Insurance premiums is no impact states follow that protocol, though most employer-based thus...